HaloMods "Classic" Read-only Archive

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:46 pm**

First off...Wasn’t warlord banned?..I’m pretty sure I’ve had him banned, banned him myself, and had my staff ban him several times over the years, and yet he always manages to sneak his way back in...Just had to get that off my chest...

I’m completely awestruck at the complete cluster-fuck you have created in your attempt to handle this situation...It boggles the mind how quickly the situation has degraded from your standard change backlash to an all out brawl...From what I can see (and this is from my years of experience as an admin of a popular forum), spawned from the admin/dev teams poor reactions...I cannot begin to fathom how you locked a (mostly civil) thread discussing issues and complaints from the community, only to promote your own thread...Rule #1 was always, do not lock a thread unless absolutely necessary, the community has a voice, and we need to hear it...After reading this thread, I would’ve stood behind any of my staff for locking it...It’s an all out flame war...The other thread didn’t have any of the name calling and accusations being tossed around that this one has...It was locked because it was creating a negative vibe on your new fancy pants site, and you don’t want anyone disagreeing with you that it’s the best thing since offset lists...

You all claim that none of you want power, it’s not a power trip...I call bullshit...I worked on the site behind the scenes for years, never once being given any staff position...You don’t need power to moderate in order to develop for the site...It doesn’t make you qualified, it never will...Moderators are qualified to moderate, and the years of experience they have makes them qualified...I don’t see moderators being given ssh access to the site so they can make changes...Because they’re not qualified as devs...Well, Tural is, but he was quite content working on the site from the background, and allowing me to upload the changes he made...He was senior staff not because I thought the title looked fancy, but because he was good at what he did...He didn’t even get a fancy title for being senior staff, and it was never publicized that he was senior staff...Modesty goes along way...

SHOUTrvb wrote:Geo worked hard and long to bring you guys the most familiar layout he could, but we still had setbacks with dealing with an unfamiliar systems.

Geo himself has defended the poorly constructed theme, saying it’s completely stock, so it’s not your fault that it looks bad...Completely ignoring the fact that it was your choice to use the theme, and your choice to go live with that theme...I’m not exactly sure which part he worked long and hard on...The clicking of ‘install’, or the clicking of ‘continue’...

You continually all say you want to listen to our honest complaints and criticisms, but when we give them, they’re rebutted with “we’re staff/administrators now, we win”, or “quit saying negative things about our site, we put a lot of work into it, and we deserve your kudos...You’re going to make us cry, and that’s not allowed”...I’ve pulled the admin card out once or twice in my day, but I always followed it up with sound reasoning why I was right, and you were wrong...And I was always right, just like I’m still always right...

And the users are right...Personalized themes should be allowed...I denied them...I also ran a forum with about a dozen custom written modifications that would have to be applied to them all...Now you’re running a stock forum with the emblem mod (which is pretty easy to add to a theme)...And I ran that forum with a great big team of ZERO developers willing to help out...I don’t see why you can’t offer a half dozen alternatives for people...

SourceGuy wrote:Excuse me? What do you know about how I pick my staff. I've worked with these people for a long time. I know exactly what they're capable of and who should be in which position. What is it with this 'deserving' 'power'. I pick moderators because they do a good job moderating, not because they 'deserve power'. That is an old halomods philosophy that I intend to defuse. I believe that is also what's causing so much resistance from the staff.

An old halomods philosophy?..Excuse me?..Pretty sure I picked staff for the last few years since I actually took a position as administrator, and I sir, take offence to this statement...It took me a lot of hard work and convincing to overhaul the staff on this site to remove bias and “friends made staff” before I was even an administrator, and I will not have the likes of you bad mouthing my hard work and dedication...

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:49 pm**

Slash fucking thread.

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 9:52 pm**

Lets face the outstanding truths for now: nothing that has happened can directly affect us yet. A new website homepage and forums upgrade is a good thing. The forum theme can be fixed, modded, and improved in the coming times (and I expect this to happen since there is now an officially sanctioned development team). However it will take time before we see the full repercussion of this change in management. I for one feel that it was incredibly short-sighted to displace and disregard members of the staff that have contributed years of their time and efforts into running this site and keeping things running well. As for the actual policies that this new administration brings with it I can only hope they succeed, but if we see more acts like members in bad standing being promoted to power positions, I for one will turn my back on this site and not look back until things are returned to order. Staff positions should be considered over time, and candidates chosen based on how the act and conduct themselves on these forums, as well as outside of these forums, not through some e-mail resume. I would suggest against choosing any new staff until things have settled down and you have had time to meet and get to know the members of this forum.

My stance on the matter is summed up as follows: i approve of the changes that were being made to the website but think the change should have been announced and talked about. I am hopeful of the future of this administration, but I fear that they might not have a clear focus to hold this community together.

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:04 pm**

New questions added. Also, we're not ignoring the suggestions.. simply because a change hasn't been initiated for everything, doesn't mean we aren't working to bring the right changes. Also, not posting a reply to every suggestion isn't us ignoring it.. I promise I've read every post here and noted all of them. Also, I don't intend on unlocking Tural's thread. I only locked it so I could make an official front page posting sanctioned by a Dev Member. So you could say that I'm further endorsing Tural's thread. The rules haven't changed or anything, I just made it more official to let the members know they were talking directly to the people in charge. If Tural wants, I'm even willing to move all the posts from his thread here, but I'm not unlocking his. For now, it'll remain a separate reference/expansion to this thread.

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:13 pm**

Because you'd rather the thread with more posts be created by you instead of him? I don't understand. You wouldn't do that if he was still Staff.

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:14 pm**

Good.
|
V

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:18 pm**

You know what.. I did say it was temporary. I shouldn't have, but I did. You're wrong about my reasons, and I would certainly have done it whether Tural was Staff or not. However, Tural is right, so I will unlock it.

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 10:59 pm**

Dontcha sometimes wish life had a big "UNDO" button?

Posted: **Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:52 pm**

Instead of having a big divide between both groups, (Staff/Dev) why not just merge the two? just like the JA/Mod/Arbiter thing, The best thing to do is unify, not divide. It just seems kinda stupid to have two groups with this whole "We do this while you do this." shit. If we're one team, why do we have two? It's disappointing really. to see what has happened. Hell, for the past few weeks, there has been little to moderate. a double post here, and a few sig violations. we aren't moderating much, anyways. Why even instill the Hierarchy? i like the "Ace in the Hole" thing we had going with the prior set up. One staff member that we trusted enough to do one better than the rest of us. If we had a problem that couldn't be dealt with with RC sentences, (which I don't see anymore. Maybe I'm still just lost in the whole new forum layout still) There was one that we could pass off an IP off and a bit of proof of their wrongdoing to and our problem was solved. But now we have several that fiddle with CSS and PHP with the same stuff I'm packing and maybe then some. If we had the same stuff, why have two groups? Give the dev guys a clever little emblem and get on with life. Make their names green and slap staff on their name. Staff is universal. Like some other guy mentioned theres the Blood sweat and tears guy and then theres the guy doing business stuff. But they're both staff. Why can't we keep it that way?

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 4:45 am**

Iron_Forge wrote:I will not have the likes of you bad mouthing my hard work and dedication...

Sorry about bad mouthing you. I should know respectable administrators don't do that.
lol

Cuda wrote:Instead of having a big divide between both groups, (Staff/Dev) why not just merge the two? just like the JA/Mod/Arbiter thing, The best thing to do is unify, not divide. ...

I've been thinking about doing this for a while now. While I believe some HaloMods members shouldn't have had a problem with this in the first place, I have compromised and merged the dev team with the rest of the staff. It's too bad that some people cannot tolerate having people above them, however, I am very content about the current members of the staff team.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 6:33 am**

I still don't see why they were above in the first place. They don't do anything with the site, just to it... behind the scenes. But, it's done and over now... and I don't know why I was worried about it, anyways... I'm not Staff...

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 11:28 am**

I find the drama of the situation hilarious.
If anything, I don't see how any of this is going to change halomods. It's mostly people hanging out in the lounge section, answering modding questions, and occasionally making a good mod. If there's a forum you don't like, don't go to it.
If anything, I see the new staff as a step-up from the previous set (Hypocritical members gone, somewhat inactive members gone too), But I will miss shadowkhas and GTAF gone (Probably the only staff I'll miss).
Fucking hell Detox, you're hilarious.
I've been lurking halomods and making the occasional post for a while, and I've never seen such a hilarious drama-filled cluster fuck.
Please proceed.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 11:44 am**

If warlord ever tried punishing me I will never come back to this site, thats hypocritical beyond belief. So shout, you better keep that guy in line.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 11:48 am**

Win wrote:If warlord ever tried punishing me I will never come back to this site, thats hypocritical beyond belief. So shout, you better keep that guy in line.

Learn to read, seriously.
Warlord clearly stated that he has no power. Now since the people on the dev team do have power, this would most probably mean that warlord would still have no power after a Staff/Dev merge.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 12:08 pm**

for better or for worse i still <3 halomods

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 12:23 pm**

Using this forum is like... playing basketball with your friend after he lost six of his fingers.

At least it's the same person.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 12:25 pm**

Win wrote:If warlord ever tried punishing me I will never come back to this site, thats hypocritical beyond belief. So shout, you better keep that guy in line.

There would be no trying about it.
I have no reason to punish you nor any means to do so.
You know very little if anything about me where as Shout, Geo and Source guy have come to know me rather well, Alot more than Iron forge up there seems to think he knows me.
Iron forge i do not wish to dis-respect you but the feeling has been mutual both ways.
I have been given a chance for that i have done alot more in the modding community than on just this site and have been recognised for it.
Also may i point out i am not the one who seems to go spreading misleading info, you know what i mean and so do i.
I've made it clear i do have power nor do i want it.
I have been a full fledged web administrator in the past and know what the work is like.
I am a Dev however not all Devs have power.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 12:46 pm**

Okay, Interesting things all around. Howeverim not sure you guys are seeing what the usersare seeing or at least I am seeing.
Right now the ex-Staff/Admins fight against the new-Staff/Dev/Admins (I still don't get the Dev terminology, as in what extra abilites do they have). Or vice versa, and believe it or not i think the single best way to visualize what HaloMods is right now is Star Wars: Ex-Staff being the rebels and the new-Staff being the Dark Side (Personally I hold no beef against either side). Oh and Iron_Forge is like yoda (old).

To put it shorter:

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 1:33 pm**

Iron_Forge wrote:First off...Wasn’t warlord banned?..I’m pretty sure I’ve had him banned, banned him myself, and had my staff ban him several times over the years, and yet he always manages to sneak his way back in...Just had to get that off my chest... He is a crafty basted isn't he.

I’m completely awestruck at the complete cluster-*** you have created in your attempt to handle this situation...It boggles the mind how quickly the situation has degraded from your standard change backlash to an all out brawl...From what I can see (and this is from my years of experience as an admin of a popular forum), spawned from the admin/dev teams poor reactions Yes...I cannot begin to fathom how you locked a (mostly civil) thread discussing issues and complaints from the community, only to promote your own thread...Rule #1 was always, do not lock a thread unless absolutely necessary, the community has a voice, and we need to hear it Other wise it looks like a dicatorship silence what He or She doesn't want to hear...After reading this thread, I would’ve stood behind any of my staff for locking it...It’s an all out flame war...The other thread didn’t have any of the name calling and accusations being tossed around that this one has...It was locked because it was creating a negative vibe on your new fancy pants site, and you don’t want anyone disagreeing with you that it’s the best thing since offset lists... *Fap*

You all claim that none of you want power, it’s not a power trip...I call ***...I worked on the site behind the scenes for years, never once being given any staff position...You don’t need power to moderate in order to develop for the site...It doesn’t make you qualified, it never will...Moderators are qualified to moderate It all makes sense now, and the years of experience they have makes them qualified...I don’t see moderators being given ssh access to the site so they can make changes...Because they’re not qualified as devs...Well, Tural is, but he was quite content working on the site from the background, and allowing me to upload the changes he made...He was senior staff not because I thought the title looked fancy, but because he was good at what he did...He didn’t even get a fancy title for being senior staff, and it was never publicized that he was senior staff...Modesty goes along way... It is also a standard tactic, the unofficial leader is spawned from the group

SHOUTrvb wrote:Geo worked hard and long to bring you guys the most familiar layout he could, but we still had setbacks with dealing with an unfamiliar systems.
Geo himself has defended the poorly constructed theme That a Majority Have spoken distaste of, saying it’s completely stock, so it’s not your fault that it looks bad...Completely ignoring the fact that it was your choice to use the theme, and your choice to go live with that theme...I’m not exactly sure which part he worked long and hard on...The clicking of ‘install’, or the clicking of ‘continue’...

You continually all say you want to listen to our honest complaints and criticisms, but when we give them, they’re rebutted with “we’re staff/administrators now, we win”, or “quit saying negative things about our site, we put a lot of work into it, and we deserve your kudos...You’re going to make us cry, and that’s not allowed” Like ... a dictatorship... Is anyone seeing a pattern here? ...I’ve pulled the admin card out once or twice in my day, but I always followed it up with sound reasoning why I was right, and you were wrong...And I was always right, just like I’m still always right... Except for that sig thing you had in your sig but is no longer in your sig. sig.

And the users are right...Personalized themes should be allowed...I denied them...I also ran a forum with about a dozen custom written modifications that would have to be applied to them all...Now you’re running a stock forum with the emblem mod (which is pretty easy to add to a theme)...And I ran that forum with a great big team of ZERO developers willing to help out...I don’t see why you can’t offer a half dozen alternatives for people...

SourceGuy wrote:Excuse me? What do you know about how I pick my staff. I've worked with these people for a long time. I know exactly what they're capable of and who should be in which position. What is it with this 'deserving' 'power'. I pick moderators because they do a good job moderating, not because they 'deserve power'. That is an old halomods philosophy that I intend to defuse. I believe that is also what's causing so much resistance from the staff.
An old halomods philosophy?..Excuse me?..Pretty sure I picked staff for the last few years since I actually took a position as administrator, and I sir, take offence to this statement...It took me a lot of hard work and convincing to overhaul the staff on this site to remove bias and “friends made staff” before I was even an administrator, and I will not have the likes of you bad mouthing my hard work and dedication... I swear this stuff in better then television.

My words In Blue. Ya know its funny... I think Halomods is doing some Soul Searching. Trying to find what It is now. In a strange kind of way, I think all this maddness may be of some help. Otherwise we would just be bitching about what makes us happy and what makes us sad. Consider me surprised.

Posted: **Sun Jan 25, 2009 1:51 pm**

As long as the thoughts we've been expressing don't fall on deaf ears as they did in the days leading up to the change, it should help. However, I'm not holding my breath. In the days of complaining, the best we've had changed is a single icon. Amazing development, really.

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